Chinese History: The White Tribes of Ancient China
4,000 Year Old Lost Tribe
One of the most fantastic finds in the last half of the twentieth century has to be the discovery of a Northern European tribe found in the northeast corner of Xinjiang province, near the Celestial Mountains and the Taklimakan Desert on the edge of the Gobi desert.
The story starts in 1978 when the Chinese archaeologist, Wang Binghus, started searching for ancient sites. He began by following stream beds, and asking the locals if they had ever come across any broken pots and artifacts. He eventually came across a few people who pointed out that there was a place called Qizilchoqa, or, as the local people called it, Red hill. Here he made the most amazing discovery, the first of the mummies. It had been placed in a grave on the side of the hill.
It was a simple site, rush mats were on the floor, and some of the bodies were buried in the foetal position. In effect, the mummies were not what you would call real mummies, in the sense that they were not embalmed. They had been preserved in an amazing way. They had been placed in the ground, which had been subjected to a unique weather system. Heat, aridity, and bitter winter cold, mixed with a salty soil, had preserved them better than other mummies found around the world. Even the clothing was still perfectly recognizable.
The bodies were excavated and taken to the museum in the city of Urumqi. There were 113 bodies taken from the site. At the time the Chinese government did not have enough funds to excavate the find. Wang eventually discovered three more burial sites.
The faces of the mummies were very well preserved, so, on closer examination, they could see that they were not Chinese. They had blonde hair, big eyes, and European noses.
At that time, Chinese tradition had always shown the fact that they believed China had developed independently from the rest of the world. Because of this, the government was reluctant to bring the finds to the public attention.
But soon they realized that the proof was irrefutable.
The most extraordinary thing about the mummies was the fact that their clothes were in such good condition. A jacket belonging to one man, over three thousand years old, still had a crimson edge. And the women had artificial extensions in their hair.
This tribe was obviously very advanced for its day. On one of the mummies, there is a scar which shows they had rudimentary operating skills. It had been sown up with horses hair.
When the West was eventually allowed to visit the mummies, Dr. Victor Mair, who was a Professor of Chinese at Pennsylvania University, took a tour around the museum. Imagine his surprise when he saw these amazing mummies, which had been kept in a dark room, in glass-topped boxes.
At this time, the Chinese authorities were still a bit reluctant to let anybody know about them, so it has taken quite a long time for the West to be able to study them properly.
Eventually in 1993, they were allowed back with a team of geneticists from Italy. And this is when they began to study them properly. They used the most up to date technology of the time to confirm the date of the mummies. They now believe that they are about 4,000 years old, and the youngest about 2,000. There are probably many more to be found, possibly in the same region of China, but it is also possible they could have settled anywhere in China, as long as the conditions were suitable to live in.
These people were from the Bronze age, they were Caucasian, and it is possible that they interacted with the indigenous people at that time. The local people probably taught them their traditions, and the Caucasians most likely introduced them to their way of life as well.
There were two cartwheels found at the burial sites, very similar to what you might find in Russia, or nearby countries. These amazing people were probably Scandinavian or German; it is amazing to think that they trekked across China all the way from Europe, 4,000 years ago, taking their traditions and language with them. How many other tribes were there? Who knows?
I think that one of the most fascinating things about this story is that the local people, even today, that live in the area where the bodies were found speak a language called Tocharian, the most eastern branch of Indo-European.
This language is closely related to German and Celtic. I think the other most amazing thing about these people is that they walked all the way across China, taking with them their families, and a mixture of animals, probably goats and sheep.
Feeling the cold, and the heat, catching diseases that they didn't know anything about, unsure whether they would survive the different climate. Babies were born, people died, and all the time not knowing whether they would be safe or if the indigenous people would accept them.
Their lust for adventure and discovering new places gave them strength and determination to survive. They were amazing people, and I hope that soon we will be able to see these wonderful discoveries and learn more about these courageous human beings that came from the beginning of history.
© 2009 Nell Rose
Comments
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Everybody is entitled to their opinion. Coward? Hardly, I don't even care about your comments as they are not even remotely interesting to me. I wrote this article a long time ago. From factual sources. I have no interest in it now.
I have closed the comments on advisement.
Tribal jews have always lived among Chinese, Burma and India without too much conflict. China spoke of them as those with the brown hair. Some would think this meant white people but it could very well be lost tribes.
Hi Nell, missed you much and glad to be back.
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My article was taken from valid archaeological reports dating through the 90s. Every single source said the above. There was no proof that they were 'controlled' by the Chinese people! the white tribes and the Chinese learned and taught each other. Please show verification of your claims as I would love to read them. As for being the Richest nation, it may well have been, but of course western people have made many inventions too, most of them what you are using today, in fact most of the world is using the Wests inventions more so than any other countries around the world. thanks for reading.
THERE IS SO MANY FABRICATIONS
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1. The mummies are in a country called " EAST TURKISTAN" the people who live there are Uyghurs (related with Tocharians) which is 600 miles away from the heart of Chinese civilization. The Chinese communist incorporated it in 1949 just like Tibet.
2. The genetic Tocharian are most similar to Iranians not Europeans.
3. If these White tribes were so advanced how come they were ruled and controlled by Chinese people for 500 years? Chinese was the richest nation, and had many rich invention. Hangzhou: The Finest and Most Noble City in the World According to Marco Polo.
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Hi truth, I quite believe that, we always tend to have a steriotype of idea about people, the one that always makes me smile is my friend who speaks very posh English, the thing is, she is Irish! the part of Ireland she comes from actually do have an English accent! thanks so much for reading, nell
Everyone is much more connected than we think we are. The first thing people say when I tell them my mom is Japanese is "oh, she must not be 100% because you don't have slanted eyes." Well, guess what? She is 100% and I am half. We can look many different ways, and we are not always so different.
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Thanks Lizzy, yes its so fascinating and it just goes to show how we travelled around the world a lot more than we thought, thanks, nell
Oh, this is interesting, indeed, Nell. I do think I saw a program about this on the History Channel a few years back, if memory serves. It just goes to show the "us/them" attitude is rather wrong-minded....
Voted up, interesting and shared.
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You people? I do have a name, and yes I did read this information from a scientific source, which by the way you write I presume you don't have!
You People need to understand about the indo-europeans to understand who the red headed people of northern china where
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Thanks jainismus, glad you liked it, nell
Very interesting information.
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Hi Shri Mc, that sounds fascinating, I will have to go and take a look, thanks so much for reading, cheers nell
This is incredible news that we keep me busy for some time now. I am more familure with Menashe culture which was original dispora out of Egypt thru Persia but as far as the mountain regions of China.
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Hi Green Bard, thanks so much, it is a fascinating subject, I would love to see it shown on tv, and updated. I think there are many different tribes that migrated around the world at that time, it will be interesting to see what is discovered next, thanks nell
I have heard about this somewhere before but you have really covered the subject really well and I have voted Up and tagged as Awesome. I am also sharing on my Facebook wall.
Caucasian as a name shuld not be politicaly correct.
I Dont like the american way of forging the history. Americ is aroudn 230 years old. where everyone that "looks" european is called caucasian . Cos its build on a missbelife that the white race is from "caucasus" today's south Russia. Which is false. White race shuld be called Indo-European , its better clarification. Cos even how you make it ....The first civilzation outside africa was India, that is a fact. And the mongol race, and white race is all made out of Indian people. However the white race was developed in north india , which is today's Iran and Pakistan, afganistan (afgans is called Scandinavian race) even in US. Not caucasian.
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Hi Larry, yes I think there are so many mixtures of race around the globe. Going back that far in time it doesn't surprise me that caucasians were in china, and who knows maybe chinese people lived in England or America too! thanks again, nell
Hi Nell. Great article and amazing photos. Voted up and shared.
A long time ago, I met a physician from Kazakhstan. His facial features were halfway between Caucasian and Chinese. That squares with photos I've seen from other Central Asian republics.
There was one surprise from a few years ago. I've also looked at photos of Sami people, also known as Laplanders. (They live in the Northern parts of Sweden, Norway and Finland.) As expected, most look like Europeans.
However I remember one photo of a nomadic Sami family from the early 20th Century. Their features were very Asian. Human prehistory is probably more complex than we think it is.
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Hi, alocsin, thanks for reading, it is fascinating isn't it? We still don't understand everything about pre history, its an amazing subject, thanks
This is fascinating -- I'd seen something about this on TV. It shows that people back then used to travel around a lot -- probably more than we realize. Voting this Up and Interesting.
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Hi, Jeff, I read this and went straight over to take a look at the Red Deer people, Wow! how many more species of humanoids are there out there? amazing! yes the homo floresiensis was fascinating, I suppose its easier to call it the hobbit! lol! for some reason, scientists can be stupid sometimes! lol! they believed that because they were tiny they must have been pretty dim minded, but I don't agree, there are tiny people around today who are as intelligent as the rest of us, but its amazing how many types are being found these days, along with the new Deer people, we have, as I said above, the homo floresiensis, and of course the Denisovans, the Tuyul are probably the 'hobbit's too, amazing stuff, I have added the link below because I wrote about that too, hope you like it, and thanks again, nell
Denisovans:
Nell,
check out the Red Deer Cave People too. They're a non human hominid species discovered in China recently. Maybe you can find out what kind of remains were found because I sure haven't been able to so far. (I'm kind of lazy sometimes.) The only Solutrian remains were a finger bone and a tooth, so I'm hoping this find is more extensive. (Hard to imagine one less extensive!) I still don't believe Solutrians were any different than Neanderthals, but who knows?
The Red Deer find seems at least as cool as the mini homo erectus bones found in that cave in Flores Indonesia. The dorks who "discovered" the site (they were led to it by locals) stupidly called the little guys Hobbits. I'm sure you've heard of them. I used to live in Indonesia and they have folk tales of "Tuyul"- small people who like to steal small objects and food like pack rats and those birds I cant remember the name of due to incipient senility. I think they still exist in Flores and probably Java and other islands too. Wouldn't it be cool if somebody found them? Of course, it would be cool if somebody proved Sasquatches exist and that hasn't happened either.
Later!
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Hi, again Jeff, Wow! I am going to investigate after writing this, there is so much there that I didn't know, its funny that you should mention the spear and the helicopter because I remember seeing that in the newspaper! thanks for all the great info, you have certainly got my interest now! lol! thanks so much, I am off to investigate, nell
P.S.,
I forget to mention that both films about the Solutrians are available for free online. Just search for them by name and they pop right up. I wish somebody would make a film about the Andaman Islanders, but the ones who live primitively (the Islands are territories of India and ethnic Indians live on at least one of them in very limited numbers,) don't want outsiders coming around. Until recently shipwrecked sailors were routinely murdered and the only film of an Islander I've seen was of a man throwing a spear at a helicopter that came by to see if they were O.K. after the same tsunami that devastated Aceh in Indonesia awhile back hit the Andamans. I guess they didn't need any help!
Nell,
I read the article Ron linked to and thought you might be interested in the following info because that story contained a lot of factual errors.
The "Negroid type (Blacks)" he referred to still exist. The Negrito race (it's a separate race and despite the name "little Negro" they aren't Negroes) is extant in parts of Southeast Asia, Indonesia, the Philippines and some other islands, though except for in the Andaman Islands in the Indian Ocean most of them are now racially mixed. Many of the Andaman islanders are so isolated and primitive they still live in their own stone age and don't even know how to start fires. In fact, they are the most isolated population on the planet. Their population group (race) is as old as the Australian Aborigines-who are Caucasians-and the Bushmen, who are also a separate race. These three races are the oldest on the planet but not even population geneticists can tell which one is the oldest-much to the chagrin of racists and racial bigots the world over.
Another blow to racists and racial bigots? Mongoloids, American Indians and Negroes are all descended from Caucasians, though the original population couldn't have possibly been of the Nordic type that most people erroneously attribute to all "White" people. (Very light skin and an unparalleled diversity of hair and eye colors.) Worse yet to the bigots is that Negroes are the youngest race on the planet. This only matters to a bigot of course, but it never fails to amaze me what can be important to some bigots.
There are Indian artifacts and remains in the Americas older than any proved to be Negrito, and the artifacts at a habitation site of European hunters found in the Carolinas is the oldest yet. However, that doesn't prove either group was there before the other, much less before the Negritos. If the Negritos did make it to the New World, they were likely the first people to do so, because the Indians were the only people living there when Europeans rediscovered it (though some Eastern tribes showed signs of racial mixing with Caucasians.) That would mean the Indians had supplanted the Negritos. The Kenniwick remains found in Washington state could easily have been those of a Negrito but thanks to political correctness we may never know. The state stupidly turned them over for interment to a local Indian tribe that claimed a fictitious ancestral link.
I hope you find this information useful. Due to political correctness it's not well known, but it is fascinating. You can find plenty of info and photos about the Andaman Islanders with a web search. The Discovery Channel (if I remember correctly) made a documentary about the Europeans who apparently traveled to America 17500 years ago called "Solutrians: The First Americans" that was very good. There was even a movie called "Ice Age Columbus." (I saw that one on Discovery for sure.) It was pretty good, though as usual the stone age humans were portrayed as being barely able to survive in a hostile environment-something that flies in the face of all known facts. The savage and deadly mega-fauna of North America went extinct shortly after the arrival of Indian hunters and the cave bears and lions of Europe didn't last long after Homo Sapiens arrived. I agree with the theory that man was the apex hunter of the last Ice-Age.
Cheers!
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Hi, Jeff, thanks for reading, yes I totally agree with you, I remember seeing a TV documentary about China. Its a shame that people want to change history, if these mummies are there then it tells its own story, I am sure that back then the white tribe of China and the local populace actually did get on, but its sad that modern countries seem to insist on their archaic ideas, glad you enjoyed it and thanks, nell
Great article Nell! I found it by chance and enjoyed it very much.
There is no archeological evidence that anybody lived in the Red Hill area but Tocharians 4000 years ago--"Indigenous" or not. From what I remember they are among the anscestors of Scythians and some other steppe horsemen societies.
Unfortunately, The "People's Republic" of China (Est. 1949) propagates a fictional history of a culture "5300" years old established by the mythical Han Chinese--who are claimed to be a race as well as a nationality. Most Chinese swallow this myth without even bothering to chew. This myth is also accepted by most Westerners who should know better but don't--for way too many reasons to go into here. Racial myths are common in totalitarian countries and China is no exception. (The muslim myth that the Near East is populated by Arabs is a similar example-also shared by most Westerners.) As you noted, the Chinese government originally supressed the existence of the Tocharians. It also claims the Tibetans are Han Chinese and that the Caucasian peoples in Western China are all outsiders. In fact, Chinese government apparatchiks claim that all the land encompassed by its borders-and then some-are traditional Han Chinese land.
Apparently the jingoistic Miss Wu doesn't know the history of the Mandarins and their contributions to modern Chinese society--including its national language. The notion that China is a continuation of all the local cultures and so called Dynasties that came before it is preposterous. The notion that those cultures developed independantly and were all composed of a single race of pure blooded Han is perfectly ridiculous.
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Hi, Winnie, facts are facts I am afraid, but who knows whether they did in fact interact with others or not? Maybe they just lived there in that part of China, thanks for reading, cheers nell
I don't Think chinese han were mixed with any other races.
Chinese Great Han come from Yellow river. we creat our own history and culture. totally different from Whites.
Just some travleers not meaning anything. I imgrate to America is that means i bulid USA??? LOL, Chinese history start 5300 years ago, not in the place where mummie found out.
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Hi, Ivona, there are so many tales or mummies found of european peoples appearing in different parts of the world. I believe we traveled far more than archaeologists say we did, our ancestors were explorers and travelers, and most of the rest of the world did too, thanks so much for reading, cheers nell
I never knew about this tribe: amazing! On a similar vein, I have been hearing some of the ancient egyptian pharoahs have european features as well.
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Hi, infinite, yes your right, it was amazing when they found these mummies because who would have thought it? It just goes to show that we know virtually nothing about ancient times, thanks nell
Ancient people obviously traveled around a lot more than some would have you believe. Very interesting.
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Hi,amanda thanks for reading it, I am so glad you liked it, cheers nell
I am fascinated with all this. I love the culture and history so much and you wrote it out wonderfully! It was an excellent read.
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Hi, Docmo, thanks so much, I remember reading this a few years ago, and have been fascinated with it since then, I believe there must be so many other things out there that we just haven't discovered yet, cheers nell
Amazing story and pics. I haven't heard of this before and it is great to learn of a new archaeological discovery. There are still so many hidden secrets from ancient civilisations- truly fascinating- voted up and awesome!
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Hi, CMHypno, sorry it took so long, I have been away from my computer more these days. they are fascinating, aren't they? it just goes to show that there really is no 'this is my country'! I believe the world belongs to everybody, especially as it has changed so much in history, thanks again nell
I have seen a couple of documentaries about these mysterious Chinese mummies and it is all very fascinating. Who knows what is still concealed beneath the earth, that will totally change our perceptions of history?
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Hi, kesinee, thanks for reading it, cheers nell
Hi Nell Rose, I have seen through your hubs and I really like it. The mysterous story about chinese is very cool hub. Chinese has a long history in Asia and there are many very intelligent ppl in the history those who influence other race or countries. Chinese mytery make your hub more intereting.
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Hi, SilentReed, thanks for reading it, I do love archaeology, and am always on the lookout for new info, cheers nell
I wonder why racial bigotry exist when the migration of ancient people that Archaeology is unearthing prove that interbreeding of our ancestors make us one family...Humans
I only recently came across your historical hubs.they are providing me with many moments of delightful reading.Thank you.
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Hi, PaperNotes, thanks so much for reading it, this story fascinated me when I first came across it, anything like this gets my interest, thanks again nell
Yet again, you impressed me with such great hub!Full of knowledge and very interesting information. China is such a big country whose culture is very rich as well. I'm pretty sure there are a lot more interesting stories that lie beneath the soils of the land.
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Hi, Druid Dude, thanks for reading it, and the e-mail, interesting point, I am not sure about the Ark of the covenant though, one of the theories is that it is in Ethiopia, I think in this case the white people probably roamed the world, helping to set up towns and villages and then intermarried with the local population. I am sure that back in those days they traded wool, cloth etc and learned from each other, Highlanders could well have started plaid, but of course they could have copied it from past finds, interesting ideas though and thanks nell
Celtic is closer. They spoke Gaelic. Purest Gaelic on Earth is from the Isle of Man. One thing your article did not mention is the fact that Plaid was prevealent. Highlanders? The Ark of the covenant, by the by, is in Jerusalem. Surprised? Evidence is in front of us.
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Hi, mr marshalle, sorry I never saw your comment, thanks for reading it, cheers nell
Hi, GMaGoldie, this fascinated me for years, I first saw it in a newspaper about ten years ago, so I thought I would go and look to see what had happened since. It just goes to show how mixed up the races of the world are, we are not all separate at all, and that's what makes us all one big family, thanks so much nell
Absolutely fascinating. I have visited China and I cannot imagine all of this. You tell the story well - how courageous they must have been. And sewing with horse hair - how did they know. Thank you so much!
wonderful pictures
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Hi, sujju, thanks so much for reading it, cheers nell
wonderful hub....very informative nbeautifully presented....thank u Nell....
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Hi, qiang, wow isn't it amazing how just one thing can change what you do with your life, and your whole dynamics, I don't think they have actually shown the TV prgramme over here about it, but it must have been quite a while ago, thank you so much for writing again, and it is always nice to hear from you, cheers nell
i remember when i first time watch the video as the archaeogists carefully open the grave. to my extramly surprise, a beautiful white woman lays inside. even after 4000 years, she still so beautiful. at the moment i did acctrully feel the touch through my heart. oh man, if i was there 4000 years ago, i would marry her.
i am not kidding, it was acctrully the major reason that motived me to study in europ and america. and for all these wonderful time i have lived, it all started with the beautiful caucasian woman.
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Hi, qiang, thank you for coming back, I remember seeing a TV programme about skull shapes, and even from one country to the next there are quite a few differences, I think that there are people in every country that always feel that they are only one culture or race, but would be surprised to discover that they are completely different to what they thought they were. I remember reading somewhere that in Scotland they found a lot of red haired men with caucasian faces actually came originally from Mongolia! it seems that Ghenkis Khan had so many children that they eventually migrated to Scotland and joined with the local picts! I was amused to read about your wife, and the fact that she has so many nationalities! lol I am sure your children will be lovely, I think that mixed race children from anywhere in the world always seem to have the exotic looks that we would all love to have! well, I would! lol thank you so much again, cheers nell
according to some of surviving chinese history record, there were always people that can be related to caucasian in northern china. aside of dna related, several artifacts had been found in china which was indetinfied to be made during Zhou dynasty.those artifact have a very strong reflect of the caucasian culture. this can still be tracked today. especially through some surviving ancient metal work. for example, compare surviving swords dated before Qin dynasty to the blade work of caucasus mountian region, its not hard to find lot of similarity.
i am a chinese, and i have decent traveling experience in or out of china. for my own understanding, chinese or Han chinese are not an ethnic group. its more like different ethnic people lived, mixed,and most important shared same culture together. today most of the chinese had lost their ancesteral apperence due to mixed marrage, but their accent still remains. even though the accent is not a very reliable way to indentify someone's ancesteral background. but it still leave us some tracks to study. oh god, the different accents in china are something that really gets on my nerves. there are several times that i went across the street to buy a cook, and i could't understand what the hack they were talking about.
btw, here are some of my own experience that might help you in your research:
during the time i was working in shandong, i had noticed the shape of local people's skull are pretty much similar to the typical hindo-europeans. my father, who was orginally from shandong, had this type of skull shape with deep eye scoket. however, i whose mother side had 1/2 manchurian triant, did not succeed most of my father's skull appearance.
anyway, i consider myself Han chinese. My wife is an american, she is mixed with italian, french, german and romanian blood. i do not know what our marrage will affect the human history 3000 years later. but i am pretty sure we can make some handsome children.
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Hi, qiang, thank you for reading it and commenting, that is fascinating about modern day chechen, this just proves that people have always travelled and mixed in with the local populace. thank you so much for that information, and have a great day, cheers nell
very intresting. and if you do a dna test you may find a large portion of the northern chinese genetic pool white.
a lot of people lived in region of yi-meng mountain in ShanDong china appear to have bigger and taller bone structure, deeper eyes. there was a research not too long ago, and found these people related to the people lives in mordern day chechen.
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HI, James, I have a book that I bought years ago, called the lost tribes of Agharti, and I had totally forgotten that I had put a slip of newspaper in it, like I tend to do when I find something interesting in the paper, and there was a small piece about the white tribes of china, so I started madly trying to find out some more and put the story together! I eventually found other snippets and this is the result. I am glad you liked it. thanks again nell
This is astounding! I had no idea about this story. Thank you very much for the education. Who knew!?
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Hi, Mikka, thanks for reading it. I had to search on the internet to try and find the right pictures. I eventually found them dotted around in old stories about archaeology, and it took quite a while. I originally read this years ago in the papers and kept the article. Then I had to dig some more out about it in old books. I will come and take a look at your work, it sounds really interesting. thanks nell
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Hi, epigramman, ha ha surely not! I am sure you don't look like that! thank you so much for saying such nice things, and I am glad you liked this hub. Nell
Hi Nell
thank you for diggin' out this story. I have heard it long time ago and seen only one b&w pic of one mummy from the newspaper article. Where did you find these pix?
Be on the lookout for the articles on these ancient peoples on my hub. These are the same people who established the famous "Silk Road" from China to Europe.
Another quirky fact is that we can find descendants of these tribes even in Japan-tall white people who still speak (modified) ancient language different than the surrounding tongues.
Thanks again
Keep it coming
cheers
Mikka
one of my favorite hubs of all time from one of my favorite hubbers of all time.
Those pictures remind me of the epigramman when he is at work doing the graveyard shift at 3 in the morning!!!
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Hi, Timothy, glad you liked it. I love looking for little known things and bringing them out into the light, so to speak! thanks again nell
Nell, what a great Hub! Thanks for working on this extremely interesting bit of not-well-known history! It certainly is news to me.
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Hi, Ron, I just checked out your link, it was fascinating. thanks for showing me it.And when I went to your home page, I realised who you were. thanks again for taking time to read this. Nell
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Hi, Ron, thanks for reading it. It is really interesting to discover who lived where and at what stage of evolution and history. I sometimes think that the so called experts are completely wrong and should start again! Everything is just guess and hearsay unless they find physical proof. Thanks again nell
It's so interesting when we think we have all figured out and then out of the blue discoveries are made that are the total opposite from our assumpions. (For example, we've been taught that the first Americans were the Amerinds whose ancestors migrated into North America over the Bering landbridge, but then discoveries in Brazil were made beginning in the early 1970's indicating that the first Americans were black: http://news.softpedia.com/news/The-First-Inhabitan...
I recall having seen a short documentary about these early Caucasians in China. Fascinating times we live in!
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Hi, mquee, thank you so much for reading it, I am glad you liked it. cheers nell
This is another good story, informative and educational as well. Again, very good work. Thank you.
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Hi, aufumy, yes I totally agree with you. On my side of the family, I am English, but am I? Unless I go back in time and check my family history, I could be anything. I know my great grandfather was Canadian, but where did his family originate from? we had red hair then, we could have been Scottish or Norwegian, anything. I remember reading somewhere that if you checked out the population of Scotland, you would find that a lot of Scottish looking males DNA originated in Mongolia! Evidently Ghengis Khan had so many children and their childrens children, that over years they travelled north to Scotland. Also, the reason a person has dark skin is because of the melamine in their blood that protects them from the sun, and the food we eat and the terrain we live on, contributes to our appearance. When people understand this simple concept, we might start getting somewhere! thanks again for writing. Nell
Thanks Nell, your comments have been very fair. I appreciate that.
I think the confusion comes today because of the definition of race, that was created in 1700's. There was no white race and chinese race until we created this definition. These are learned concepts that form the beginning of so much hate. I write up a little history of race on my blog www.racialize.com.
When I began to unlearn the concept of race, I began to see so many lies that surround us daily, and it makes me so frustrated. We cling on to these fake concepts of race. Usually the only reason to cling on to these created concepts, is to justify using, pillaging and killing the "other" race.
What we need to learn, is what our forefathers were never taught. That there is no white race. There is no chinese race. Yes there was discrimination too, but more in terms of which tribe do you belong to, as you also mention about tribes.
Let's examine race, who is white? Are you? What if you are Italian, some might say you are some might say you are not. What if you are mixed 1/4 Indonesian as many Dutch might be today, are you still white? What if you are Mexican and can trace most of your ancestors as being Spanish, but mixture of other things as well. The definition many times depends on who is asking, which culture they are from, what the current definition is today. This is completely subjective.
The same applies to being chinese. Here are some photos of the different ethnicities or races of China
www.flickr.com/photos/teanitiki/sets/72157623403515817
All these people are from China, and are Chinese, but are the ones that are Muslim are they also Chinese? Yes, they likely have arabic race and culture, but they are still Chinese, are the ones up north who may speak russian or polish, are they Chinese? Yes they also are. One Caucasian I met, who could speak more than 20 languages, I asked him what he was, and he said he was Chinese. I was shocked and thought he was playing me. He made a joke that I was racist. He was indeed born in China. He is Chinese.
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Hello aufumy, thank you for your comment. I understand your feelings behind your words. We should all respect each other, and whatever our nationality, we are all equal because we all live on the same planet. People have travelled the world for centuries, and as above, at that time in china, many people probably moved about in small tribes and groups. And because the evidence shows that these people above, obviously lived there for some time, I would imagine the ill feelings that people can sometimes have today towards each other, may not even have crossed their minds then. They probably mixed together, both races, to find trade, goods and comfort in their place where they lived because of the weather and terrain. It is a shame that the seperation and mistrust that the world has now, probably didn't even occur then. Thank you for your interesting comments. Nell
I like this article, as I think the concept of race is quite simply ridiculous. Yes you can find genetic similarities between isolated groups of people that inbreed. However the categories that people use in everyday conversation such as white race or aryan race, are mostly imprecise and unscientific.
To cleanclover, you have quite simply been brought up to be racist because of your grandfather. Please don't spread such lies about Chinese people. Also, read up about how the Tata's from India helped to start the opium war, which led to the taiping rebellion where 30 million chinese died, all because of the greed of opium dealers.
No wonder people in China have such mistrust of other nationalities.
While there may be a coverup of such evidence, there has also been a cover up about asian races in North America and other parts of the world, likely Europe too.
So who created who? Who is the original race, who cares!? One could postulate any variety of theories, for what purpose? To prove what exactly? That you think Chinese should be your slaves, and are naturally untrustworthy?
I mean come on, get your minds out of the toilets.
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Hi, shining, sorry it took so long, my computer died on me! that is an interesting story. yes we never will know the truth about the ancestors anywhere really, but hopefully with archaology, things might start coming to light. thanks again nell
Hi, Ben, yes it seems that these red haired people were all over the place. very strange, I hope that one day, we will get to the bottom of the story. It will be very interesting, especially if we found out exactly where they originated from. thanks again. nell
Very cool article Nell, I never heard of these adventurers, really exciting. I did here of a legend of ancient red-haired people that moved to India, have you ever heard of them? Anyway, well written piece!
Ben
hi there, I am Taiwanese, whose blood is partially Chinese (unlike what China claims about us). My first big racial shock came when a Turkish friend showed me pics of his dad and uncle when they were young. They looked identical and identical to my grandpa when he was young.
And then I remembered my dad said that my grandpa's eyes are yellow (what you would describe as amber) and his nose rises sharply like a Caucasian btwn the eyes. But my grandpa and his family have been living in Taiwan for at least 200 years..
And reading the Chinese texts from 3000 yrs ago (a requirement in school) and the Chinese tales of their origin. They describe almost all of their hero ancestors as with yellow hair, red curly beard, big long ears, and very tall (6 ft to 6'6" based on the length unit at the time). Isn't that a perfect match to these mummies? A Chinese even wrote a book a few yrs ago about how he thinks all these Chinese nationalist stories about Chinese being black hair, black eyes were all lies.
It really makes me think that maybe there is no such original race called the "Han" Chiense, but just a mix btwn many different ones in the Far East and, sometimes, a recessive gene in DNA shows up like in my grandpa's case.
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Thank you so much, driver. Yes I think it was possible that the local people probably helped them, and they became traders between the tribes. We will never know, but maybe there will be something found to prove this. I think many countries and peoples have traveled around the world and lived together, but as you say, history gets muddled and people only see half the picture. thank you again nell
I think this is very interesting. These kinds of things have and probably will be oppressed for a very long time. I wouldn't say that the whites enslaved the people of china, but this could be a reason for the Asian racial divide.
It would only make since that the euro settlers would have had contact for trade and the seeking of knowledge. The Germanic in those days generally didn't breed with slaves unless there was a long term relationship of the people. This also could be an indication (assuming that they bred into the mongol race) that there was a peaceable ideology, or a long term relationship with the local Asians. It is theorized this very thing happened in Egypt and many other parts of the world. Possibly even in northern America far beyond the time of these people. These types of finds will help bring lost history, original hybrids, and lost technology to the attention of the biased modern world. Lots of cooperation and organization could redeem some of this but its unlikely as history erodes faster than we can discover it.
Thanks for bringing this excellent information to public attention. GREAT INFORMATION.
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Hi, prasetio30, I am glad you liked it. not many people do know about this, I think it is time that they Televised it, it seems to be such a long time since they have found it. thanks again nell
The first time I saw the picture above, it little scared me. But this is real. You have great information that I never knew before.
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Hi,TLMinut, Yes I agree with you, I remember reading about this story though about ten years ago, but it is strange that it hasn't been televised yet. Maybe they are still discovering more bits and pieces and need to document it yet. thanks again Nell
Every time we think we know something, we find out more! The earth's surface is volatile, how much is lost and buried, melted away, how much is barely under that will be brought up? This is very interesting, I hadn't ever heard about them at all before.
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Hi, Bbudoyono thanks for reading it. cheers Nell
Hiya showmetv, I will come over and have a look, thanks for stopping by. cheers nell
I just made a tribe hub.
This is really amazing. Thanks for this wonderful hub.
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Hi, Hotspur, yeah it is weird, but I do think that maybe we don't know enough to say where we came from yet, but it would be good. I believe that maybe different tribes started up independantly around the world, not from one place, but somehow obviously connected somewhere, but who knows? maybe we were all different at the beginning, but interbred somewhere along the line to connect the DNA, ya never know. thanks again. Nell
Remember hearing about this a while ago; thanks for the hub I love all this histiry stuff and I think the more we discover the more we realise our interconnectedness...I love the idea that everyone from Europe, Asia, the Americas and Australasia is related to a couple of hundred people who walked out of Africa via the Arabian peninsular...!
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Thanks Cleanclover for your comments, your points are very interesting. Cheers Nell
I feel the chinese are very intelligent and hard working. I have seen them and they are really loyal to their nation and language so are the japanese. I have respect for them. They are so well developed in science that the rest of the world actually don't know the real china. America is very open culture so we have access to the real knowledge and research also the language is common so it helps. Chinese language is the toughest in the world and they tend to be secretive. They are masters of deception. You see at the Beijing olympics i thought USA would get most gold medals but China beat USA handsomely. Non-Chinese need to be careful of these Chinese.
I feel china and India are going to be 1 and 2 economies by 2020 and that's no exaggeration. Again America will have no answer to China.
It dates back to 4,000 years doesn't it? They are among the oldest of all civilization. Always Secretive and i doubt they shared real knowledge or information with the Caucasians. Chinese are fierce competitors and they won't help a non-Chinese no matter if they are allied to them, that's what i feel.
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Hi, Cleanclover, bless you don't be silly everybody on the planet is equal and your grandfather needs a kick up the backside! You will always get one person or two who think their race of people is more superior, it is usually someone who is as thick as pie! Getting back to the white tribes of china, it is just that they were found buried in china and are 4,000 years old. I believe that the chinese people taught them and the white people taught them things as well. totally equal. which is how it should be. There is a lot of racism in the world. sometimes it is ignorant white people sometimes it is black people hating white. I can't be doing with any of it. We are all the same. simple as that. anyway thanks again, lol Nell
Thank you Nell for this wonderful hub.
So was china invaded by caucasians and were the caucasians the original race of china?
I am a mixed caucasian as well my great grandfathers were pure aryans, they were racist as well wonder why they married the local dravids here? My grandfather used to support one race theory that aryans are the only humans and every other race is soft second class fit only to be slaves.
I am not a racist. :-) for it does not matter what blood you have but what you think and feel isn't it? My grandfather disliked me too for i am not a pure blood aryan.
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Hi, thanks Shanewer for commenting, yes who knows? maybe the ancient white tribes mixed with the chinese people and we taught each other. The coming together of cultures probably helped both of us. Thanks again. Nell
Fascinating history and very relavent to the advent of advancements in Chinese culture. It was after the arrival of these Germanics that you start to see the rise and advancement of ancient Chinese technology, culture, etc.
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Hi Jon, thanks for the comments, I know, I agree with you, I like seeing new things discovered that make history turn on it's head, and they have to start again! cheers Nell
Hi, Rose. I like reading articles about the human past. Like Tom Cornett, I wonder why those people got to China. Or they must have been there ever since. Ah, we really live in a very mysterious planet.
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Hiya, thank you so much for your nice comments, it makes me feel great when i read something like that. I really appreciate it.lol nell
This is a really awesome story. You really have a great hub there. Thank you for bringing it to our attention. It is so outstanding.
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